425

A

Anonymous

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On the oil pressure issue, i like to see 10 psi for every 1000 rpm, so for 6000 rpm i want to see a minimum of 60psi. I really noticed more consistancy in oil pressure and better oil pressure by going from a nice/modified aluminum housing to a melling cast iron pump, especially when it gets hot.     
 

Darius

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rowaid said:
  These were much better cars than the later Golden Hawk that had the Packard engine - way too heavy, and all in the nose.  I suspect the Cad engine was not all that much heavier than the Sudebacker V-8, even tho the Stude was only 264 inches (memory might be a few off!). 

Regards,  Bob

The Studebaker V8s were not light weight engines and the one borrowed from the Packard was  heavier still.

- - - - -
"An excerpt from a 1957 Salesman's Data Book shows the 1957 Golden Hawk at 3400 lbs."

"A chart in Studebaker-The Postwar years, by Richard Langworth, lists the 1956 Golden Hawk at 3360 pounds. The Complete Story (William A Cannon, Fred K. Fox) also shows the 1956 Golden Hawk at 3360 lbs, and the 1957 Golden Hawk at 3400 lbs. It also states, "The 1957 Golden Hawk, at 3400 pounds shipping weight, was actually 40 pounds heavier than the 1956 Golden Hawk, but the weight was distributed more evenly."

"A March 1979 article in Car Collector puts the weight of the 352 [Packard] V8 at 725 lbs.
Richard Quinn sent a chart from a 1953 True Magazine which showed a 232.6 CID Studebaker V8 weighing 687 lbs. If a 289 weighed the same, then the addition of the supercharger would put the weight at about 737 lbs. This would mean the 1957 Golden Hawk engine and supercharger weighed 12 pounds more than the 352 used in the 1956 Golden Hawk."

_The Handbook of Engine Swapping_, by John Thawley, 1960 list the weight of the Cadillac 390 at 720 pounds so ALL of those engines are HEAVIER than our 472/500s.

Darius
 

stepchild

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Pageboy,
Thanks for the pictures, For the sake of my ignorance, has this manifold been modified or not? Would your manifold fit my motor or would my heads have to be extensively ported to port match?
To the rest of you GENTLEMEN who replied, Thank you all! Darius, I don't know what the 390 weighed, but at the time, the only car that I ran up against that blew my doors off was a 396/375 Chevelle, i'm sure there were others capable but for dollars spent that Cadillac got the job done. Torque motors RULE.
Does anyone know where I can buy a Makita die grinder, at a realistic price? Thanks again.
                                                                                                              Dennis
 
A

Anonymous

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Look around the net for the GEO-600....my favorite grinder by far
Last one I bought was about $125 or so you should be able to almost match that somewhere

Remove the middle from a stock intake,blend all the radiuses inside and port match it
will not kill the torque .....and that is what your after..TI
 

rowaid

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Thanks Darius for the research on weights, etc.  I had forgotten the Stude was only 232 inches, my recollection was that it was about the size of the 265 Chev of the time.  But that weight - no wonder they say these engines are ripe for about 30-40 lbs boost with a turbo or supercharger!

I'm just about to stab my modded 500 where the 390 used to live in my '62 Cad - between the lighter engine and lighter transmission and lighter A/C system, to say nothing of the alloy manifold and lighter headers, probably have to cut a full coil out of the front springs!  If I had enough gelt for a set of alloy heads, I'd probably have to run wheelie bars to keep the front end down. lol  Seriously, it show that there has been some advance in the state of the art over the years.   Regards,  Bob
 

pageboy

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Yes, this manifold has been ported. It is an early dual plane style, specifically a '68. It is on the car in the picture here. Stock, this manifold has webs between the primary and secondary barrels that run all the way down, where the bores make a hard 90* turn into the runners. In fact, the roof of the runners actually raises back up a little just past the carburetor bores. Stock unported manifolds are extremely restrictive. I cut the webs out between the bores, and also put as large a radius as I dared to carve out at the bottom of the bores where they turn into the runners. I left quite a bit of shape to the center divider, rather than cutting it down to just a straight piece like you see in most aftermarket manifolds. I just don't like the huge step change in area from the carburetor barrels into the intake plenum. Any other sharp corners in the plenum area were blended out and rounded off so there are no sharp edges anywhere and there is a smooth change in area through the whole thing. If you pick up one of these and compare it to my pictures, it will greatly help you understand exactly what was cut out. I don't use a spacer under the carburetor on this because I want the engine/car to appear stock from the outside. But a 1 or even a 2 inch 4 hole spacer would probably help a little. I wouldn't use an open spacer on a manifold done like this one. An open spacer would only be used if you are going to carve the entire plenum all the way out. If you really want to get trick with the 4 hole spacer, you could carve the web in between the primary and secondary barrels down to a V shape at the bottom, maybe not a hard point but rather rounding it off a little at the bottom so there are no sharp corners, and match it with the shape of the plenum at the manifold.

For porting an intake like this I use a tree or flame shaped carbide burr on a short shank, and also a tree and a cylinder shaped burrs on a 6 inch shank to reach the runners of the lower plane.

The runners of the 425/472/500 are all generally the same size. Only the usual port matching between heads and intakes would need to be done. The runners of the 368 intake and heads are much smaller in cross section, and using the aluminum manifold from that engine requires a whole lot more work.

As far as finding a Makita die grinder, check ebay. I've gotten more tools through ebay that I thought I would never own, just because they're too expensive new from a store, or else too hard to find any other way.

Lynn
 

stepchild

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TORQUE INC said:
Look around the net for the GEO-600....my favorite grinder by far
Last one I bought was about $125 or so you should be able to almost match that somewhere

Remove the middle from a stock intake,blend all the radiuses inside and port match it
will not kill the torque .....and that is what your after..TI

TI,
Thanks for the advise, on both.
                                  Dennis
 

stepchild

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Lynn,
E-Mail sent on the manifold.
                            Dennis
 

stepchild

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TORQUE INC said:
Look around the net for the GEO-600....my favorite grinder by far
Last one I bought was about $125 or so you should be able to almost match that somewhere

Remove the middle from a stock intake,blend all the radiuses inside and port match it
will not kill the torque .....and that is what your after..TI

TI,
I found a Makita GEO 600 $103.45 + S&H  Here is the info for anyone that needs it.
                                         
                                   S&J's Discount Tools
                                   2892 Prairie Dr.
                                   Lewis Center, OH 43035
                                   1-888-810-1025
                                                                                                                      Dennis
 

76Eldo_convertFI

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Anybody used this die grinder? I've found it from about $70 - $100 around the Net.

http://www.astrotools.com/viewprod.asp?id=196

1212.gif

Astro Pneumatic Tool Company Part # 1212
1/4" Extended Shaft Die Grinder w/ Safety Lever Blue Composite Handle - 22,000 rpm
 
Description:
• High speed
• Positive grip body for easy control
• All ball bearing construction for long tool life
• Lever throttle for positive speed control
• Rear exhaust air flow system
• Extended shaft provides access for hard to reach places


Specifications:
Collet Size: 1/4"
Free Speed: 22,000 rpm
Overall Length: 13â€
 

smalltruckbigcid

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My biggest complaint about air die grinders is my hands get cold when using them for a long period. About the quality of that tool, never seen or used that one before. Hmmmm, buy one and tell us if its any good lol
George
 

stepchild

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George,
The Makita grinder mentioned is electric.
                                       Dennis
 

smalltruckbigcid

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I remember this discussion came up a long time ago, but is an electric easier on the hands when doing port work? I have both straight and right angle die grinders and the cold body from the airflow just messes with my hands.
George
 

randydupree

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hey guys,i go to harbor freight when they have die grinders on sale and get like 10 air die grinders,then i can put all my burrs and sanding rolls in them,i just change the air hose to different grinders ,instead of changing tools all the time..works for me.and the cheapo die grinders work good for awhile.you can get them on sale for less than $10 each..
 

randydupree

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i agree that harbor freight tools are junk,but the die grinders work ok,plus,if you have 10 and one blows up,who cares? it really makes the job go quicker! same thing on valve work,i get 4 pilots for the seat grinder,one in each guide,then i can go right down the line and do all the seats with all the angles ,fast.
 
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