Sourcing Con Rods

[gordon]

Have any of you had success sourcing Con Rods for your 472/500 Cads 7.0" or longer and sized on the big end for the stock 2.5" journal dia. Pin dia optional but .990" preferred ? Seems the Cadillac parts suppliers are out of them and probably won't get anymore in my lifetime. I attempted to contact an Oldsmobile performance place that showed 425 rods 7.0"long and the correct big end bore size but they do not respond via emails and never answer the phone. Trying to avoid the Oliver , Crower, and Carrillo , $$$$$ route. I am considering going with Scat Chrysler 7.1" rods and turning the rod throws on the crank to 2.375" and narrowing the rods a bit. What say you?

 

[5one9]

Why the desperation for 7” rods? You’re going to spend extra money with no noticeable difference.

 

[gordon]

Not desperation just prefer longer rods. I have to purchase custom pistons so I figure I would get the rod length that I prefer. Reason for custom pistons is my block is fresh bored and honed for .050" and no one has forged dished pistons (950 heads) in that size. I do not want to bore this block again for now. It seems our selection of part sizes is in decline. This engine is intended to be a 500 hp/ 600 ft/lb. Street engine in front of a manual trans in my 53 stude. The reason the block is fresh bored and honed to .050" is previous owner before his death had it bored for big block chevy cast small dome pistons on olds 425rods and 120cc heads. Big miss match of parts I did not want to utilize.

 

[5one9]

Don’t let the current bore size pin you down and make things more difficult than they have to be. You’d be money ahead to just bore it on to 0.060” or 0.080”. It is your money.

 

[Cadillac Kid 1]

At something like $15.00 per cylinder to bore the block,it is not necessary to go through any hoops to keep the .050 over and find pistons. Plenty available in .060 over. In regards to longer length rods, the intent is to bring a 500 closer to the "ideal" 1.65:1 rod length to stroke ratio. I've got K-1 , 7.1 inch rods and the change from stock rods "seems" to have made a slight difference, but I can not quantify it.
Greg Surffas

 

[gordon]

Greg I certainly do appreciate the advice and point of view. Much of which I can agree with. Unfortunately around here block boring has not been $15 a hole for a long time. Currently at the only shop I can trust (still have to watch them close),costs $ 45 a hole to bore and hone without deck plate. It is not just about the money . I have a end goal of how I want this engine to be spec wise. If It were not for the Holidays I would be on the phone to K-1, Molner, Oliver, Crower, and Carrillo. Three of which I have run their products in the past. I am looking at retirement soon (I am 64 now), and try to save were I can with out loosing sight of original goal. I like longer rods, always have. I am very aware of the long versus short debate. I fall on the long side. I can no longer buy at dealer or WD like I did years ago but I did talk a piston manufacturer to make custom forged (my choice of alloy) pistons for me at a very reasonable price. Just under $700. The fellow in New Mexico wanted over $1200. That price diff bites into valve train bits and bobs on the list. Hope all the guys (and gals) on here have a Merry Christmas and hopefully a great New Year.

 

[underdog]

I ordered a set of 7.1 rods 3 years from MTS/CHP ago to go with the pistons that I bought from a former member here.
Also ordered piston rings at the same time. Never got any parts, or a refund.

 

[gordon]

That is not a good thing. I have been burned in the past also. My eyes are open on this.

 

[48Austin]

Why not give these guys a call? Home | Custom Aluminum Connecting Rods (rrconnectingrods.com) They told me a few years ago approx. 1200. Just have to send them a sample. I know, aluminum. But forging tech. has come a LONG way since the 60's, 70's, and 80's. Ran a Poncho on the street with "Super Rods" on the street in the early 80's. Not a problem. I am going to run aluminum. Not for strength, even though that is a plus, but to make the rotating mass lighter.

 

[gordon]

Yes that is an option and I have/am considering that. Back in late 70's a local bracket racer at my then home track in central FL. put over 100,000 miles on a set of BME AL rods that his wife raced in the bracket series every weekend. Never had them out , never a problem.

 

[48Austin]

I ordered a set of 7.1 rods 3 years from MTS/CHP ago to go with the pistons that I bought from a former member here.
Also ordered piston rings at the same time. Never got any parts, or a refund.

MTS/CHP was bought by somebody in IL. IL. states attorney is looking into them now. BBB has given given them an F rating. For non delivery of goods, services. Sounds like somebody I was reading about on this site awhile back that was member. So now we have only CadCo and our own digging. And who knows what will happen to CadCo. Courtney is in his '70's. You may think that's cold, but it is a fact of life. My 12 year old dog died on Christmas eve. Sure gave me a wakeup call.

 

[gordon]

Ever since the beginning days of racing , the racing business can be brutal. Got my first taste in my late teens. Started learning the world of running a Funny car . It was an older Lohgge Bros. (wide chassis) Corvette bodied(69') powered by cast iron Chevy BB (427). This was dinosaur compared to what things had evolved to by 1975. My partner and I thought we could give the big boys a good run. We worked our selves into the ground. Learned a ton about peoples character and what extremes people will go to ,to make a buck. Needless to say after two more modern FunnyCars and several years on the road mostly match racing , My partner Larry Nadeau (FC 279) and I never made the big time. We came real close and almost landed a much needed big time sponsor . The Deal got nixed at last minute during second board room meeting. We had really awesome mentors helping to keep us out there. These included World Funny Car Champ Shirl Greer and Jerry Gwynne . There were some real dirt bags out there making it big by screwing a lot of people but I should not go into that . Could be labeled as just sour grapes. Bottom line is being in business is tough, being in the racing/performance business is really tough. People can start out with the best plans and intentions but things start to unravel and pressures mount , bringing out the worst in people. I hope that MTS/CHP get leveled out and take care of their commitments to Customers.

 

[Darius]

Gordon,

Thank you for that bit of history; and for sharing a glimpse of your own depth of commitment to motor sports, complete with the challenges and pitfalls of our chosen addiction.

While hope may spring eternal so too does greed. Sadly, those who prey on others seldom work to make things right for those they’ve defrauded.

Best to you - and all who gather here - for a better coming year!

bro. d

 

[48Austin]

Yes that is an option and I have/am considering that. Back in late 70's a local bracket racer at my then home track in central FL. put over 100,000 miles on a set of BME AL rods that his wife raced in the bracket series every weekend. Never had them out , never a problem.

Have also considered BME. But as with any aluminum rod, girth is a factor. How much am I going have to notch the block, if at all? Guess I'm going to find out. No matter what company.

 

[James Sample]

I just got a complete set of stock length forged rods from Flashcraft. Excellent hardware for the money. For the hassle of getting longer rods, it doesn't seem worth it. But that's just my 2c.

 

[48Austin]

These on bay right now. H-BEAM 850HP Falcon Connecting Rods 6.750" Cadillac 472 500 V8 1968-76 Floating | eBay Don't know whos. But at that price must be china forgings.

 

[Darius]

These on bay right now. H-BEAM 850HP Falcon Connecting Rods 6.750" Cadillac 472 500 V8 1968-76 Floating | eBay Don't know whos. But at that price must be china forgings.

Not to hijack Gordon's thread; but I was wondering who, if anybody, is a current source of forged I-beam and H-beam rods for the Big Cadillac engines - at standard lengths?

bro. d

 

[48Austin]

I think CadCo. Who there supplier is ? I would call any of the EM's and give them measurements. Sure anyone of them would shoot a price.

 

[gordon]

Life is full of compromises, how many and how big is an individual choice. For me I stick mostly with few and small. I was in search of the elusive 7.1" after market rod that fits our Cad 2.500" dia. rod journal. I found and bought a set of 7" H beam rods . I am cleaning them and mic'ing all the dimensions now. Monday I order pistons . Undecided on a simple round dish or a modified D' shaped dish that somewhat matches the shape of the combustion chamber. A 33-34 cc dish will put me right at 9.8-10.0:1 . Pin height of 1.645 would put me at '0' deck height and allow the total piston to head clearance to be set by the head gasket I end up using. I am shooting for .040 +/- .003". Going to research head gasket choices tonight. Bore is 4.350"

 

[5one9]

If you’re happy then we’re happy.