Richard Holdener is gonna boost a Cadillac 500

5one9

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Messages
479
Reaction score
142
Points
43
Location
WV
What vehicle(s) do you drive?
2007 Magnum SRT8, 1957 F100
Since we haven't had a whole boat load of stuff going on here I thought i'd post this for our enjoyment.

I am an avid fan of Richard Holdener on YouTube. He typically boosts the crap out of junkyard (and built) Ls engines, but now he's been airing a series called "The Other Guys" and it covers about everything except BBChevy, SBC, and Ls.
Tonight I see where he got a 455 Buick and a 500 Caddy. He says he plans to flow bench the heads on both engines, try different intakes, cams, etc. He was even asking opinions on what to do. I don't have Facebook so I won't be chiming in, but surely somebody will. Then he will be turbocharging them. Should be fun to watch and see what he can make them do. I've been gathering parts for boost on mine but haven't decided on turbo or Procharger yet. This might help me decide.

Check him out if you want some entertainment. We can watch together.
 

Red98422

Active Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
396
Reaction score
207
Points
43
Location
Washington state
Definitely a fan of his as he has been pushing the boundaries regarding engine aftermarket and has no trouble with challenging what was formerly held to be gospel regarding engine building and boost.

I will be watching with great interest
 

Caddylackn

Active Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2015
Messages
160
Reaction score
68
Points
28
Richard said he was going to flow test the heads first. Looking at the crazy Gremlin drag car this engine came out of, I wouldn't be surprised if they had a home port job so not a good baseline. I am interested to see how much flow. I hope he cranks up the boost on this one.
 

5one9

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Messages
479
Reaction score
142
Points
43
Location
WV
What vehicle(s) do you drive?
2007 Magnum SRT8, 1957 F100
The Caddy Faceball's page already listed it , and the arguments already started.:(

Doug in P.R.:cool:
Richard Holdener tends to bring that out of people. Since most of the Facebook crowd is all mouth that never finishes a project anyway, I’ve never joined. I hope this thread doesn’t get ruined by a bunch of that type of nonsense.

I’ll be watching intently to see what he does to get it setup. I tried to read the turbocharging thread on this site but honestly the intro thread turns me off. Obviously written by someone who already knew everything and didn’t want to be bothered by the same stupid questions that he had when he started out.

Let’s enjoy
 

Monzallac 425

Active Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2008
Messages
881
Reaction score
61
Points
28
Location
Salinas, Puerto Rico
The usual, what heads, cam , stock bottom end, what parts, turbo manifolds, turbo builds never get finished , etc, etc, etc, ( 59 replies as of now )


Doug in P.R. :cool:
 

Red98422

Active Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
396
Reaction score
207
Points
43
Location
Washington state
Yup some folks seem dead set on seeing an all out build (boogie man setup), which honestly isn’t really his style and let’s face it not a remotely affordable proposition for these engines anyways.

I’m kinda wanting to see what he can do with a correctly clearanced stock bottom end, as thats going to be a great interest and very achievable to newcomers to this engine
 

Red98422

Active Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
396
Reaction score
207
Points
43
Location
Washington state
Richard Holdener tends to bring that out of people. Since most of the Facebook crowd is all mouth that never finishes a project anyway, I’ve never joined. I hope this thread doesn’t get ruined by a bunch of that type of nonsense.

I’ll be watching intently to see what he does to get it setup. I tried to read the turbocharging thread on this site but honestly the intro thread turns me off. Obviously written by someone who already knew everything and didn’t want to be bothered by the same stupid questions that he had when he started out.

Let’s enjoy
hey now I resemble that remark hahaha! :rofl:

as for the other turbo stuff, that particular thread goes way too far into detail and nearly touches condescending IMO as calculators and turbo spec availability have come a long way. If you want a good basic guide check out the turbo fourms. Great resources
 

robocop

Active Member
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Messages
202
Reaction score
25
Points
28
Location
Miami, Florida
What vehicle(s) do you drive?
1987 Cutlass Supreme 2 door with 500 Cad/Turbo 40
Back in the early 70s there was a unique 6 wheel topless car with turbo 500 Cad power called the Panther. Maker claimed 600hp. Shouldn't be too hard to top that.
 

5one9

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Messages
479
Reaction score
142
Points
43
Location
WV
What vehicle(s) do you drive?
2007 Magnum SRT8, 1957 F100
My hope in this is that he uses a single turbo so that I can get a template for mine. Trying to figure it out online gets bogged down quickly in opinion. Again, most folks on the turbo forums claim to be a pro mod racer and don’t actually have anything to show for it. People seem to be bad about passing on info that they haven’t tried themselves. I suppose it is a lack of attention during their upbringing.
 

Caddylackn

Active Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2015
Messages
160
Reaction score
68
Points
28
He posted a video of the tear down of the 500 last night. Had a spun rod bearing but the mains didn't look trashed and there wasn't metal through the whole motor.
I like that he went straight to the Cad motor and is not dinking around with the 292 or 455 yet.

It looked like it had 472 flat top pistons to me, but there was no good video of the pistons. It had large chambered heads, so maybe that is a '74 - 472?

It also was missing two push rods? WTF? Somebody must of canabilzed them out of motor when sitting in the shop or something.....That would explain why there was no oil pressure.
 

Red98422

Active Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
396
Reaction score
207
Points
43
Location
Washington state
He posted a video of the tear down of the 500 last night. Had a spun rod bearing but the mains didn't look trashed and there wasn't metal through the whole motor.
I like that he went straight to the Cad motor and is not dinking around with the 292 or 455 yet.

It looked like it had 472 flat top pistons to me, but there was no good video of the pistons. It had large chambered heads, so maybe that is a '74 - 472?

It also was missing two push rods? WTF? Somebody must of canabilzed them out of motor when sitting in the shop or something.....That would explain why there was no oil pressure.
that is exactly what happened, the original owner of the engine (David Freiburger) had to steal two good pushrods because of a lifter failure on the replacement engine
 

Darius

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2004
Messages
4,386
Reaction score
785
Points
113
Hey Guys,

I posted a question to Richard Holdener about the "Other (Big) Guys" project he had started, but which after running into a few hurdles, seemed to be losing steam. He replied back. Here is the exchange.:

Darius Gray
21 hours ago
******************************************************************
Richard,

How's it coming with the "Other Big Guys" project? Inquiring minds want to know. I'm especially interested in that Big Block Cadillac.
Please don't forget us "other guys."


Best,
Darius

Richard Holdener
15 hours ago
HEADING OUT TO SEE COURTNEY FOR CADDY TESTING


Darius Gray
15 hours ago
Richard Holdener

THANK YOU!!

Darius

Mr Bob
1 day ago
The GM engineers knew what they were doing...I’d take that low end power increase any day
 

5one9

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Messages
479
Reaction score
142
Points
43
Location
WV
What vehicle(s) do you drive?
2007 Magnum SRT8, 1957 F100
We'll keep him pumped up 'cause I want to see about 15psi on that thing.
 

Darius

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2004
Messages
4,386
Reaction score
785
Points
113
We'll keep him pumped up 'cause I want to see about 15psi on that thing.
I'm with you on that. We need to let Holdener know that there's a bunch of Cadillac Big Block lovers who want the details - NA and Blown!!

Based on what others on this forum have done with their turbocharged Cadillacs - plus Cortney's lifetime of experience, Richard is heading in the right direction.

"Supposedly" my project has been built to sustain about 22 lbs of boost at maximum - depending on RPM. Realistically, if the sucker holds together at 18.5 lbs and 4800 RPM, I will be One Happy Guy!

d
 

Attachments

5one9

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Messages
479
Reaction score
142
Points
43
Location
WV
What vehicle(s) do you drive?
2007 Magnum SRT8, 1957 F100
So you're looking for that magic 1000hp to huh?
 

Darius

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2004
Messages
4,386
Reaction score
785
Points
113
So you're looking for that magic 1000hp to huh?
Might as well before I die. Nothing else to do really. But it's that FAT TORQUE that sells me.

Both of my turbos are variable nozzle units (VNT), which combined with the custom controller box should provide full boost very, very early. Final numbers to be determined, but I would not be surprised to have full boost before 3,000 RPM depending on how deep my foot is into the thing. ;)

Right now the turbos are good for about 550 HP each, as far a air flow. However, they are capable of over 35 LBS of boost at moderate RPMs. The "Hot Side" when fully open has enough capacity to flow far more exhaust. Currently the "limit" would be on the compressor side. However, there is a straight forward set of compressor wheels, and compressor housings, reasonably priced, to add an additional combined 350 HP of air. However, the current injectors, and dual Holley fuel pumps (E85), would need that 15.1 Volts of your alternator to feed the thing. :geek:

As is, it's probably enough for an old man driving a homely, 1950 Studebaker - with AWD. Can we say, "Sleeper"? :sneaky: :sleep::sleep:

bro. "Dreaming" d :sleep:
 

5one9

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Messages
479
Reaction score
142
Points
43
Location
WV
What vehicle(s) do you drive?
2007 Magnum SRT8, 1957 F100
Might as well before I die. Nothing else to do really. But it's that FAT TORQUE that sells me.

Both of my turbos are variable nozzle units (VNT), which combined with the custom controller box should provide full boost very, very early. Final numbers to be determined, but I would not be surprised to have full boost before 3,000 RPM depending on how deep my foot is into the thing. ;)

Right now the turbos are good for about 550 HP each, as far a air flow. However, they are capable of over 35 LBS of boost at moderate RPMs. The "Hot Side" when fully open has enough capacity to flow far more exhaust. Currently the "limit" would be on the compressor side. However, there is a straight forward set of compressor wheels, and compressor housings, reasonably priced, to add an additional combined 350 HP of air. However, the current injectors, and dual Holley fuel pumps (E85), would need that 15.1 Volts of your alternator to feed the thing. :geek:

As is, it's probably enough for an old man driving a homely, 1950 Studebaker - with AWD. Can we say, "Sleeper"? :sneaky: :sleep::sleep:

bro. "Dreaming" d :sleep:
I don’t know about sleeper but I’d like to be in the passenger seat holding the camera toward your face the first time you stand in it. Bring a change of drawers!
 

PJ McCoy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2015
Messages
1,254
Reaction score
355
Points
83
Location
Outter Banks NC
I've been following the you tube channel as well. What do you all think about how much boost the stock bottom end can handle. From my research, It seems like its all about piston speed. If I were to go with a boosted application my numbers came out to a very low 4-8psi. Pushing the envelope would be 10psi. Again, this calculated by piston speed. As with a N/A engine, the heads and cam choice on a stock or stockish bottom end is what determines the speed of the piston. As power goes up so does the piston speed, which translates into the forces being applied to the connecting rods and piston pins @ TDC/BDC. So I figured my head flow and fuel demand, piston speed etc. This was easy math but took a while getting my numbers.
Big If here.,

If my numbers are right, should be close, My total Potential Horse Power x my % of head flow(I used stock flow numbers for my heads and lift of my can) I got 359 HP.

Not dynoed. So this is mathematics so their is a margin of error. Also my head porting, which was a lot to me, might not have done much except to make me feel good about my work. Lol.

Garrett's Gt45 turbo, I believe will be a great fit for my application. The density ratio chart places that turbo with a 76% efficiency.

For safety and durability I plugged in figures using a low density range, because I know I will want to increase boost @ some point.
1.2-1.5. Again. This is to achieve an efficiency rating above the 65% low threshold level. Anything above that is good.

So for my engine, the math says:
Again. Low boost.
Sorry D, I ain't going big. If I were to go BIG their would be only ONE PLACE in my life I would GO BIG. It ain't my car. Humm "Pandora's Box"

I've been doing the Garrett's Turbo training online. Just for the fun of it. I'm learning a lot.
I converted the PR to lbs/min
4psi=1.27 PR =Low 53lbs/min
8psi=1.54 PR =high 66lbs/min
10psi=1.68PR=highest 72lbs/min
Rule of thumb 1lb air= 10hp

Low boost 4psi, based off head flow and piston speed. 530hp
Higher(low) boost 8psi 660hp.
Higher (low) boost 10 psi 720hp
If I can verify that these numbers are in the ball park. Adding a turbo would be the BEST BANG FOR THE BUCK! HP/$$

My concern is the connecting rods being stock. Remember the piston speed mentioned above????
A safe piston speed for stockish application is 4000-4500 ft/min

So in order for me to find the optimal boost pressure, I have to now find what boost pressure will be a safe boost for my stock rods and dial that boost in.
I never thought math would be so fun.
PJ
 
Top