No longer caddy powered

Discussion in 'Off Topic, B.S., Lounge' started by yellowroket, Feb 13, 2018.

  1. 48Austin

    48Austin Active Member

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    So now we have two? Giving up? The problem is you are going with a WAY to heavy body! Put one of these things in a light car then see what happens! My car weighs 2100ibs. So how much motor do I have to build to get it into the 9's? Not much! And still be streetable!
    Oh just forgot. Doing a blower, because it's a Gasser.
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2018
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  2. El Diablo

    El Diablo Active Member

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    There is just something undeniably satisfying about making a battleship run the 1320 in 9 flat.
     
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  3. 48Austin

    48Austin Active Member

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    This can be done "No Problem". Bowtie crate motor. Or better yet, Crate "Demon"! And yes, you can buy a crate "Demon". I think it's in the area of 18g. basic.
     
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  4. 8ad-f85

    8ad-f85 Well-Known Member

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    Would $18k into a Cadillac do the trick?
    I bet it would.

    People are undoubtedly frustrated with having to re-engineer past some limitations with the engine and the cost of aftermarket parts put it into a different category than when people started rodding them.
    Add in the aspect of the local shop horror stories and it can be a challenge.
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2018
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  5. yellowroket

    yellowroket Well-Known Member

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    I have "reliably" made 500-550 hp. In my opinion the caddy is very economical at that power range and makes one hell of a fun street machine. Any more than that, take a deep breath for the huge kick in the balls coming your way lol....been there done that had the swollen go nads to prove it. If someone shows me a way to make say 750-800 flywheel on a caddy for less than 6K that will stay together I will be back in a heart beat. 48 I wish you the best luck on your build and really hope you can make awesome power and not have to wrench on it all the time.

    At 2100lbs and 500 hp "reliable" caddy should pretty easily push you to 9.80-9.90s if you can get it to hook but how many street cars can come in below 3000lbs. 500hp will be fun at first but I can promise after a year or two you will want more lol. I cannot afford to be the R&D for a bad cad or pay the crazy prices for parts anymore. I drooled over the MTS single plane for probably over a year. Finally scrapped up enough money to buy one (at 3 times the price of "other brand engines") and had to port on it for over a day and re-drill all the bolt holes because the angle was off.

    My turbo ls is almost complete. I am reworking the stock truck harness to be standalone, need to reroute my fuel lines, remount my battery to the trunk with a disconnect and it will be ready to fire. I have $5700 total investment right now. I spent a good bit extra and some parts that I really did not need but wanted. Added SFI flex plate along with a JW ultra bell for the th400 and a $1000 PTC torque converter. Also wrapped my entire hotside with DEI wrap with S/S ties (about $250) and some deka 80lb injectors ($325) where I could have decapped the stock flex fuel injectors for about the same flow. Could have reused my converter used an adapter plate and not went with what I mentioned and saved about $2K. It might blow up right off the get go but I am out at most $600 for another junk yard truck engine that are everywhere. We will see how it goes. On paper it should make around 700 whp, run mid to high 9s and be able to drive it anywhere.

    Robbie
     
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  6. 48Austin

    48Austin Active Member

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    Just my luck. Decided to do something different as usual. Then when I find a place to get info people are leaving. Don't know what Dave is going with. But I hope everybody is going quick. I just have to do it different. Hope you're not going anywhere Dave. Mad has seamed to have disappeared. That doesn't mean he gave up. Something could have happened. Just need to keep digging in the archives.
    Oh. and at 2100 it is a street car. Car was rated at just over 2000lbs. new.
     
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  7. 48Austin

    48Austin Active Member

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    But is the "Battleship" power going to be standard for the day or off the wall? Everyone is going LS. But nobody is going Hemi. Let alone V10 Ford or Chrysler. Where is the development there? I will NEVER get on the band wagon! I will make things as hard on myself as possible just to prove I could do it.
     
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  8. Cadillac Kid 1

    Cadillac Kid 1 Active Member

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    I am having fun with my 13.01 (2.48 60 ft) 5000 pound barn door. When it quits being fiun, i'll quit doing it.
    Greg Surfas
     
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  9. 8ad-f85

    8ad-f85 Well-Known Member

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    The development is where people forecast sales in parts or checks written for builds.
    There's a lot of work involved to cultivate a market, and then protect your interests along the way.
    Are the V-10's and Hemi's plentiful and cheap yet?
    Shhhh, don't spoil it! Let them sit without demand like the Caddy's did for decades.
    I'd dream of those too, but they seem boring for now.
    Aren't the V-10's the same as the 8's in basic design?
     
  10. Darius

    Darius Well-Known Member

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    I guess most of us here could be accused of marching to a different drummer. And why not go that way?

    Robbie, I hope to make that 700-800 at the flywheel reliable enough for a daily driver - and do it for less than 6 K. Will I make it? Don't know, but I'm giving it a try. I seriously wish you well in going after it with the LS platform. From my perspective, it has become pretty darn simple to make big numbers these day but the trick is making them last.

    With other platforms it is the tune, the tune, the tune!!
    With the abundance of forced induction choices, electronic fuel injection to keep ratios in line, wide-band exhaust sensors to seal the deal and intercoolers to keep detonation at bay, more is possible today than ever before. Then there is E-85!!!

    Applying those same "tools" is what I hope will make my horsepower numbers live a long happy life. Robbie, YOUR past efforts with "the corn" and turbo boost has set the stage, and for that I thank you. My friendly challenge for a heads-up meet is still out there. :D
    I'll post about the latest progress in my own thread .

    best,

    bro. d
     
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  11. 48Austin

    48Austin Active Member

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    I have NO idea why the Hemi is so expensive. I'm a mech. for a living. So I see this all over the place. Hemi's everywhere. Call a scrap yard when one lets loose? 2 or 3 g's. And they do let loose. Eat lifters, then cams. "Check Engine" lights mean nothingo_O.
    The 10 Fords look Exactly the same as the 4.7-5.8 when you first open the hood. Then you start looking further and go "Holy Crap It's Got A Ten". Not very common. But more common than the Dodge 10. Have never seen a dodge truck 10 in person. So I could couldn't say on design. I do know that it's different than the Viper.
     
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  12. 48Austin

    48Austin Active Member

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    So now I have done a little research on the 10's. Seems the Dodge truck is not as plentiful as the Ford. But is less money {under a G} on queerbay. But the Ford is 1500 and up. Almost forgot. The Dodge is 8.0 based on a 273,318,340,360. The Ford is a puny 6.8.
     
  13. 8ad-f85

    8ad-f85 Well-Known Member

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    So they suffer the same malady as Caddy's did before aftermarket parts were made available (V10's).
    Anything can be made if a person doesn't mind tossing cash at it, anything can be tried if you don't mind financing it.
     
  14. El Diablo

    El Diablo Active Member

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    Before I decided on a Cleveland or my other project, I was actually considering the Triton V-10. I think one with twin hairdryers would be unique. Who knows, I may still look into it. But my Cleveland is expensive enough as is.
     
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  15. 8ad-f85

    8ad-f85 Well-Known Member

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    That Cleveland brings up a great point connected to our Caddy obsession.
    A machinist/engine builder(?) designed and made an improved aftermarket block to get past the hurdle of the fantastic cylinder heads available having the capability of demolishing the block.
    Anyone care to comment on what lengths everyone had to go to using the factory block in order to hold the power level before they were available?
     
  16. El Diablo

    El Diablo Active Member

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    My block is actually a 351M / 400. I have the Pro Gram splayed 4 bolt main caps on the middle 3 mains. It has been deburred inside & out to eliminate stress risers. Oil gallery passages enlarged and smoothed. Stress relieved on some sonic table I know nothing about, and the lifter valley glyptaled.

    Some guys will do a half fill with Hard Block. Pro Gram makes a splayed 4 bolt rear main cap but its over $500 by it's self. Then some shops also sell a main girdle for it but its all just a longer fuse on the grenade when you go much past 700hp.

    But from what I understand with a Caddy, people are not breaking blocks from power. Parts are failing from inadequate lubrication and / or incompatibility with other parts.
     
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  17. 8ad-f85

    8ad-f85 Well-Known Member

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    The block structure and bearing clearances are part of any engine's oiling problems though.
    The double edged sword with any of these thin webbed blocks (B and O 455's too) is that the mains aren't rigid enough, so block flex adds a component to the oiling problem.
    If set too tight, there's bearing contact during component distortion.
    Too loose and the pump can't keep up.
    The Olds forged rods used in either engine still needs to run loose to avoid deformation from how soft they are, or rod bearing problems are soon to see.
    Even cap strapped and halo'd, things wiggle around from weight and rpm.
    Harder and lighter components can run a bit tighter generally speaking.
    It can be difficult to separate out what's being seen at failure time, but the engines with more rigid bottom end have much easier hurdles to overcome with oiling.
    All of these respond favorably to really light/stiffer rotating assemblies.
     
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  18. El Diablo

    El Diablo Active Member

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    This is the reason I want to do some of these bulletproof tricks to my 500 while its apart. No one has ever had an issue with an "over built" engine. The ARP main studs, halo girdle and a good pump should be plenty for my stockish combo for now but will be nice to have later as I do more as time and $$$ allows.

    Btw, the head guy at Centerpoint CNC has stated that he is looking at the big Caddy to develop a high volume high pressure billet pump. Not sure what the difference is but I was told that the Centerpoint pumps for chevys are a little better than the Titan. Let's cross our fingers for this one.
     
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  19. 8ad-f85

    8ad-f85 Well-Known Member

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    As discussed in other threads, the suction method has potential shortcomings before the pump is fully utilized.
    That's one of the things that happens along with the major pump swap already.
    I'm not completely convinced of the pump simply being inept without seeing more work with the tube.
    If everyone showing oiling problems was already using a 1" ID inlet then I'd be feeling different.
    I forget the accurate differences, but I'd measured a BBC pump to be smaller(?) and even with more area to bleed off when built with looser clearances yet, it still pushes the extra capacity out the relief.
     
  20. 48Austin

    48Austin Active Member

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    What about the Ponchos? Main problem with the big ones too much main bearing.
     

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